.
Feedback

TSPLOST: Trains, Trollies and a Beltway?

$8 billion is a tremendous sum of money for citizens to voluntarily surrender

Contributed by Jim Regan

TSPLOST is a 1-percent sales tax on everything residents in the 10-county metro Atlanta region purchase to fund regional transportation projects. TSPLOST is expected to generate $8 Billion ($8,000,000,000) in revenue over the next 10 years.

Citizens for Transportation Mobility, the group supporting the Untie Atlanta campaign, tell us the referendum will create 200,000 jobs in Georgia and solve the metro area's traffic congestion problem. 

Who is Citizens for Transportation Mobility? It’s really hard to say for certain since they have failed to disclose contributors as required by Georgia law, but media reports have said the $8 million campaign to pass TSPLOST is being funded by private companies which would benefit from contracts relating to road, bridge, and mass-transit projects. Last year, Siemens, who manufactures transit rail systems, ran a radio campaign, touting the advantages of mass transit.  Currently Yancey Brothers, a Caterpillar equipment dealership, is sponsoring a website advancing TSPLOST.  No doubt asphalt manufacturers, road construction firms, and civil engineering firms are also contributing to this effort.

The Transportation Leadership Coalition’s (TLC) analysis of the TSPLOST projects indicates 52 percent of funds raised by TSPLOST will be spent on mass-transit projects (light-rail, beltway, MARTA), which will only serve 2-3 percent of regional commuters.  TLC also points out that TSPLOST will only cover the studies, surveys, initial-design and in some case right-of-way acquisition for many listed projects.  Actual project construction will have to wait for another source of funds.  Maybe the next round of Federal stimulus money for “shovel ready” projects? 

We agree that Atlanta has a traffic congestion problem and would like to see a solution, but spending $4 billion on mass-transit when MARTA reported that train and bus ridership was down in 2011 does not seem wise.  

Who is going to pay the ongoing operating costs of these mass-transit systems after they are built?  Do the projections call for the mass-transit projects to be self-sustaining or are future government subsidies required?  What about the impact of telecommuting on traffic congestion as more companies offer employees this option?  Might it be more economical for government to encourage this trend?  Could other changes be implemented to alleviate peak rush hour congestion?  Might semi-trucks be restricted from area interstates during peak hours as is done in other cities?  What about reversible lanes used by many other cities?  TSPLOST doesn't address any of these questions and possible solutions.

We don’t have the answers, but $8 billion is a tremendous sum of money for citizens to voluntarily surrender with little oversight and no assurances that Atlanta’s traffic problem will be resolved.  Until these questions are addressed our recommendation is to vote against the TSPLOST. 

Bottom line, whether you support or oppose the TSPLOST, vote on July 31. 

Jerry Fuchs July 15, 2012 at 12:29 pm
I'm tired of the tax payers being treated as children, expected to just do what the 'adults' say because they know best.
I'm voting NO.
Jim Regan July 15, 2012 at 03:31 pm
If this TSLOST plan is so great, why doesn't it stand on it;s own merit? Why is the promise that it will create 200,000 jobs.
Anytime government or any other entity must justify a project by future jobs to be created I feel certain they are vastly overstating the impact, or just lying to mislead the public.
Jim Regan July 15, 2012 at 03:35 pm
Nancie, I truly understand your state of confusion. If we vote this one down, we have an opportunity to focus on projects that will solve traffic congestion when plan "B" is voted on in two years.
If we spend 52% of this on mass-transit future TSPOSTs will be dedicated to funding the continued operating expenses which will not be cover by ridership.
kathy Presley July 15, 2012 at 04:38 pm
I work at a place on the Clifton Corridor and we are receiving emails from higher up urging us to vote but coming short of telling us how to vote. I am voting NO. No tax ever seems to go away and this only benefits certain areas and certain residents. The CDC is already too large and bloated anyway. They should downsize, not expand.
Finch July 16, 2012 at 08:12 pm
Having "educated" myself on what is hidden in the plan, there is no way to support this "job's programs" for the well-connected. Let each county have their own one cent t-splost and keep all the funds. Then the citizens of each county can decide what roads to widen and what type of mass transit they want, rather than having an unelected group of good ole boys deciding how to carve up our money for their own benefits. Gwinnett doesn't need Atlanta telling us what to do. I have yet to see a list of all these 200,000 fabulous jobs. Talk about throwing out something to see if it sticks.
Finch July 16, 2012 at 08:14 pm
OOPS = I stated in a previous post that MARTA gets 52% of the funding. They get 6%. Mass transit gets 52%. Want to make sure we are not promoting information that is not factually accurate like the "pro side" is doing.
Jeffrey Allen July 17, 2012 at 01:41 pm
If you vote yes, I suggest leaving the coins at home. You'll need 'em, every time you shop for groceries the D.O.T. will be there with one hand out and the other pointing and laughing at how the taxpayers got taken for a ride.
No. NO. NO! to TSLPOST
The Other Donald July 17, 2012 at 03:02 pm
The Atlanta Regional Commission has worked hard to sustain a minimum of 50 percent of funding for rail. The elected leaders put aside partisan politics, whittled down a $23 billion project wish list to $6 billion, and then unanimously approved it – a signature moment for the region.
There are stories appearing that tear apart the work and the effort that went into getting the metropolitan Atlanta region to this point around the transportation initiative. Yes, this will create jobs, keep our region competitive and safeguard Atlanta’s position as the leading city in the Southeast. How many jobs doesn't really matter, but you can be certain more than not passing this. It will move Atlanta forward into a new century of progress in the eyes of those living here and in contemplating moving their businesses here! I am confident our voters will continue to educate themselves, and not be misled by deliberately negative stories and go to the polls on July 31 to vote Yes on this.
MDG July 17, 2012 at 04:59 pm
This tax question is complicated, filled with concern about my tax bills, plus worries about how we can grow our regional infrastructure beyond today/tomorrow's gridlock. I have been stuck on the question lately... How about the millions of visitors we have visit our region, spending money at the mall, baseball, football, concerts, six-flags, conventions, etc. That is a lot of money from people who currently do not contribute to the support of infrastructure* (other than gas tax), BUT do their share of abuse of the infrastructure.
R July 17, 2012 at 05:01 pm
First sign of failure…
We’ll use OTHER People’s Money, it WONT cost us anything!!!. Keep repeating this every single week while you buy food for you and yours. And you do you remember that we still some NEW state sales taxes that haven’t taken hold yet right?? – This TSPLOST addition would be above and beyond those too. A “No Brainer”? Absolutely if you have one - VOTE No! Since the ARC already admits the project list as is WON'T change commute times, which was the reason businesses were concerned about to start with...
R July 17, 2012 at 05:03 pm
Because the past NEVER repeats itself right? The tolls on GA 400 will go away - someday...
R July 17, 2012 at 05:05 pm
Jobs? They had to beat the Propeller Fellers estimates for BRISCOE...
R July 17, 2012 at 05:10 pm
Political leaders coming together from all over to reach a consensus on how to SPEND NEW tax revenue really isn’t news to most.
Now put those same leaders in a room to reach a consensus on how REDUCE current tax levels or CUT fraud FIRST and then you have a REAL signature moment for the region.
Jim Regan July 17, 2012 at 05:17 pm
There are special taxes already on all these visitors to pay for a variety things. Remember there is a rental car tax to pay for Coolray stadium and a hotel tax to pay for the convention center.
I'm all for solving traffic congestion but this TSPLOST plan won't do that regardless of who is paying the bill or how much is spent. The mass-transit projects are not the solution, yet consume 52% of the funds.
Catherine S July 18, 2012 at 02:21 am
Transportation Leadership Coalition / TrafficTruth.net just made news today, as they have uncovered a list of some of the donors to Citizens For Transportation Mobility (who have apparently not filed with the ethics commission by yesterday's deadline). Here is the link: http://www.traffictruth.net/index.php/2012/07/press-release-tsplost-donors-uncovered/
The Other Donald July 18, 2012 at 03:14 am
Over the past 50 years in the older cities of the mid-western part of the U.S.  such as St. Louis, Detroit, Indianapolis, Cincinnati, and Cleveland we have seen that as a result of a failure to provide both for   proper transportation and  quality schools their growth has  become stagnant.  Corporations are shrinking or departing  and as a result  young adults are also  leaving .  This is a major problem for these cities as depicted in the latest National Census Report.
If one examines the growth patterns in metropolitan Atlanta it would be apparent to even the casual observer  that growth, if any,  has become miniscule! Corporations moving into the metropolitan area has slowed to a trickle, some companies are either shrinking or departing the area; unemployment is among the highest in the nation; and population growth has become stagnant. The issue of the quality of our schools is currently being addressed throughout the metropolitan area; the issue of transportation remains to be addressed. Please vote ‘YES’ for the T-Splost…
kathy Presley July 18, 2012 at 03:49 am
Throwing money at something is not the solution. Atlanta schools spends more per student than any other school system in Georgia and look at how poorly they do. Corporations are not moving into the metro area because of over regulation and taxation. They move to Alabama instead. And who can afford to own property in Atlanta?
The Other Donald July 18, 2012 at 03:57 am
Not even those who oppose the passage of the T-Splost  deny that transportation is a major issue for the entire metropolitan  Atlanta. Not since the development of the Interstate Highway system has this city had the opportunity to address the issues of transportation which could  influence the growth of the entire metropolitan area. That was also 50 years ago! It is an illusion to believe that any alternative plan to that which is provided in the T-Splost  such as ‘toll roads’ could provide adequately for the growth of our city  which includes  the outlying communities as well.
  Now is the time for each of us to invest not only in our future, but in the future of our children as well.  If the T-Splost fails to pass on July 31st the future growth of our metropolitan city will be imperiled. The opportunity is at hand to take the necessary steps to see that our future as a city is secure.   Please vote ‘YES’ for the T-Splost
Harry Dorfman July 18, 2012 at 04:02 am
We might be able to reverse this corporate flight by better advertising the $14 million dollar fishing museum that our past Governor assured us would make us Americas tourism destination. Speaking of the x-gov....wonder if any of this money will benefit his Savannah shipping/transit investments?
Finch July 18, 2012 at 11:39 am
There is no debate about the need to improve the traffic issue. However, will adding more buses to our roads fix the problem? We all know how traffic flow frees up when the school buses are off the road during the summer.
In order for the buses to improve traffic, we would each need to abandon our cars and get on the bus. Ridership on buses is going down because it is impractical for the metro area to rely on buses. Think about this. If each county kept all of their T Splost money, they would be free to come up with their own plans to improve the roads and schools in THEIR area. Gwinnett could have that mag-lev train to Athens, St. Simons and beyond. Cobb could have their bullet train to Washington D.C. or whatever they wanted. The current plan places a group of unelected officials in charge of the money. What is in print right now, can change with the next legislative session. There is only one reason why the Secretary of State added "bait" language to the ballot - to manipulate you into voting for a fantasy. If you vote yes to this scam, you have locked up your tax dollars for ten years - there will be no additional projects proposed or implimented, Plus, federal dollars are drying up so in just a couple of years, you'll be hit with another vote to pay to maintain the roads. VOTE "NO" TO T-SLOST
Finch July 18, 2012 at 11:39 am
I received a call last night from Kennesaw State University conducting a study for Gwinnett County on the SPLOST Gwinnett County voted for a few years ago for parks and libraries. They wanted to know if I was going to vote to renew that tax. I asked WHY? If the parks and libraries have already been built, why renew the tax. Their response - to maintain them.
Finch July 19, 2012 at 01:50 am
Just received a flier showing that Clarke Howard support this rip-off. Sorry Clarke, this is where you and I will disagree. You've gone to the dark side.
DaculaHood July 19, 2012 at 02:05 am
Thanks for the tip Finch, surprised and intrigued Clark would endorse TSPLOST... looked and found the source (I'm listening now)...Scott Slade, Herb Emory, Clark Howard "round table": audio: http://www.wsbradio.com/Player/101383071/
Kristi Reed (Editor) July 19, 2012 at 02:55 am
My husband got a robo-call with Howard's TSPLOST endorsement message this evening. I didn't get to hear it, but am genuinely surprised he supports this.
Suzanne Laisney July 25, 2012 at 10:18 pm
Thank you for putting in your post the locations for early voting....I am a commuter who drives one hour on the HOTT lanes to go to work in Hapeville, although I live in Lawrenceville.
Having seen the FIASCO first-hand of something that was SUPPOSED TO HELP commuters with the Peach Pass on 85, I am decidedly going to vote NO. Prior to the PeachPass being implemented my commute was around 40 minutes. Now with this "NEW" and "IMPROVED" HOTT lane commute, I am not only FORCED to use the HOTT lane (as all other lanes are impassable at 6:00 am) but the HOTT lane is slow too ....PLUS I am paying for my added stress now. If this is an example of what our politicians feel is "progress" then I can tell you with certainty that special interests are at work again. VOTING NO TO THIS ! I strongly encourage you to do the same!
Claire July 31, 2012 at 02:45 pm
Where is the plan of attack? I need to see more clarity here before this is a yes. Come on!! Give me some information to say yes to, not just a bunch of "if's, ands, and buts!"
The Other Donald July 31, 2012 at 02:54 pm
........and if IFs and BUTs were Fruits and Nuts, Every Day would be Christmas on this blog!
Educate and Please Vote YES....All the planning you need to read about comes from here at this time: http://www.t-splost.com/
Jim Regan July 31, 2012 at 03:10 pm
I say vote no so we can get a plan that really solves congestion not just a developers dream financed by the taxpayers.
As someone pointed out yesterday many of the proposed projects won't even begin for 7 years, other have already been funded by the GADOT. TSPLOST 2012 is just a boondoogle
Finch August 14, 2012 at 02:12 am
Back to the drawing board. But this time, think of what can be. Have a contest and allow the brightest minds to come up with a far-reaching 22nd century system for the metro area. It certainly will not have buses spread around the area nor will widening one corner of dirt off 285 and 400 do much for most citizens. The airport works because it has flights going everywhere not to a few select locations. Fixing the road system should do the same thing. People move to this area for the subsurbs - not fro the City of Atlanta. Heck, many of us live in gated communites to ensure we are removed from Atlanta. TSPLOST was nothing more than a means to save a dying city that has no purpose, no luster, no future.
Jim Regan August 14, 2012 at 11:47 am
If you want to think 22nd century the future maybe autonomus electric commuter vehicles which resemble SmartCars more that SUVs. Actually the renderings in Popular Science look more like two-person pods than cars.
Of course I'm still waiting for my flying personal transportation unit promised me in 3rd grade science class as demostrated by the Jetsons. If we could only get those then we wouldn't need to waste money on Trains, Trolleys, and Beltways. Roads would probably be lightly used by bicyclists for entertainment and exercise.

Newsletter & Alerts

Get the best stories each day and important breaking news

Subscribe

Not from Dacula Patch? Find your Local Patch »

Note Article
Just a short thought to get the word out quickly about anything in your neighborhood.
Share something with your neighbors. Write a new post... What's up? Make an announcement, speak your mind, or sell something
Dave June 18, 2013 at 10:43 pm
Packing peaches near the SC/NC border at $0.60 an hour and all the peaches you could eat. I stillRead More hate peaches to this day.
Kristi Reed (Editor) June 18, 2013 at 07:42 am
Indeed. I hope everyone will take some time to explore the site, check out the features and thenRead More look for the feedback button on the right side of the page. Click on that to let Patch know your thoughts on the new platform.
Dave June 18, 2013 at 08:46 am
It's pretty but I found lots of bugs. I'm sure these will be worked out over time. It's new soRead More we'll give it some time.
Kristi Reed (Editor) June 18, 2013 at 08:54 am
Yes, unfortunately I've found a lot too but the engineers are working on it and hopefully we'll haveRead More a much more stable site shortly. In the meantime, please report any issues using the feedback tab on the right side of the page. Thanks!
Robbi McCaig June 12, 2013 at 12:08 pm
"There are people in all levels of government office who would like nothing more than to beRead More able to conduct all the public business out of public view" The problem is, who's going to stop them? Certainly--no one from this justice department who is complicit in multiple overreaches and coverups.
Tammy Osier June 12, 2013 at 12:41 pm
I wrote this on another post but it so applies here and is worth repeating: James Madison wrote inRead More the federalist paper (no. 51) concerning the separation of powers and need for limited government , "“ It may be a reflection on human nature, that such devices should be necessary to control the abuses of government. But what is government itself, but the greatest of all reflections on human nature? If men were angels, no government would be necessary. If angels were to govern men, neither external nor internal controls on government would be necessary. In framing a government which is to be administered by men over men, the great difficulty lies in this: you must first enable the government to control the governed; and in the next place oblige it to control itself. A dependence on the people is, no doubt, the primary control on the government……” We need to have a "Madison moment"...
Tammy Osier June 12, 2013 at 12:41 pm
I remember when I opened up the news to see that Holder was going to investigate Holder. Ha! What'sRead More scary is that there are some who think that's just fine?
Linda Davis June 18, 2013 at 08:48 pm
Thanks Erin, we will know by the 30th of June who won the Bammy Award for my category. Keep meRead More lifted up in prayer. Linda